I am so very, very concerned. Some churches lead their people to declare that the words they say are the actual “words of God”. This is a very serious issue for folk who give heed to the NAR type churches. Do you attend one?
Are you (by your approving attendance there) authorizing mere men and women with the supernatural ability to speak for God – His exact words? Or, you yourself? Why would God give you “inexact” or “untrue” words to share?
Are your words
ever “exact words of God” —
as Old Testament
prophet standards require?
See: Words of Mere Men Are Not God’s Words
As if God had said those words
Very scary thing to do, to speak on behalf of God as if God said those words for you to share. I would say that by Old Testament standards — you all are full of it (merriam-webster.com Phrases: “not to be believed”).
Truly. And you are “wrong” in your thinking — as Jesus said in another situation: You are all wrong, Jesus said (in the Amplified Bible)
“You are mistaken,
since you do not [s – know]
understand
the Scriptures
nor the power of God.”
– Matthew 22:29 NASB
“You are all wrong” AMP version
I am so very, very concerned because…
1. In the Bible God has declared: “I am against you….” – you who misrepresent Me (Ezekiel 13:8).
2. Heaven will not entertain even one person with whom God is against. Not a one! Obviously. He does not save those with whom He “is against”.
Note: He is for all
who come to Him in repentance
with “sincerity and truth”
(Galatians 6:7-8; 1 Corinthians 5:8).
See Whosoever: Matthew 10:32; Matthew 10:33; Mark 8:34; Mark 8:35; James 4:4; Revelation 22:17
3. Hell will be full of people that God is against. Think you are different because you are so “nice”?
4. Who in Heaven (and much less on earth) will be so pompous, and arrogant, as to stand right in front of God’s very presence and say, “I have a word from God…”, and then merely speak their own words (as if God will agree, or He doesn’t know you are lying)?
See: Will you be turned away by Jesus?
The True Church
There is a huge difference between that (the “you who misrepresent Me” of Ezekiel 13:8)
(1) pretending your words are God’s words, and
(2) Christian preaching and teaching “what the Bible says” (…the Bible actually being “the Word of God”).
Born again preachers and teachers do not claim to receive new “revelations” from God every Sunday. The Bible suffices. They teach “the Word”, and do not claim their own words are God’s words given specially to them.
Disclaimer: Lest I be misunderstood, let me be very clear that I do not agree with the new charismatic NAR-type doctrines. I believe they go contrary to the Bible.
Jesus Himself taught us, in John 3:9-11, how to speak forth about spiritual things. He was talking to a high-ranking Pharisee named Nicodemus:
9 Nicodemus said to Him, “How can these things be possible?” 10 Jesus replied, “You are the [great and well-known] teacher of Israel, and yet you do not know nor understand these things [from Scripture]?
11 I assure you and most solemnly say to you, we speak only of what we [absolutely] know and testify about what we have [actually] seen [as eyewitnesses]; and [still] you [reject our evidence and] do not accept our testimony.
Recorded in the New Testament we read that an angel spoke to John, the author of the book of Revelation. This is what the angel said,
9 Then the angel said to me, “Write, ‘[a]Blessed are those who are invited to the marriage supper of the [b]Lamb.’” And he said to me [further], “These are the true and exact words of God.” – Revelation 19:9
A better standard – from Jesus
Prophets of God do not guess or hypothesize (or, I say facetiously: “hypo-the-size” of their words!). Jesus also was “a prophet”. And as a true prophet, Jesus said :
“we speak only of
what we [absolutely] know
and testify about
what we have [actually] seen
[as eyewitnesses]”.
– Verse 11 of John 3:9-11
That is the high standard Jesus put forth for prophets: speak only what you know to be true, what you witnessed personally. That is why many say prophets could not exist after the generation that were actual eyewitnesses of Jesus’ time. And verses 9-10 of 1 Corinthians 13 say:
8 Love never fails [it never fades nor ends]. But as for prophecies, they will pass away; as for tongues, they will cease; as for the gift of special knowledge, it will pass away. 9 For we know in part, and we prophesy in part [for our knowledge is fragmentary and incomplete]. 10 But when that which is complete and perfect comes, that which is incomplete and partial will pass away.
Understand the Scriptures?
Understand God’s power?
– Matthew 22:29 NASB
Jesus came as “that which is complete and perfect”, and thus did away with several of the gifts (my numbering added) : (1) as for prophecies, they will pass away; as for (2) tongues, they will cease; as for (3) the gift of special knowledge, it will pass away.”
9 For we know in part, and we prophesy in part [for our knowledge is fragmentary and incomplete].”
Jesus began the early church with special effects, special gifts — so that the world would see that He is God. After the early church was established then “that which is incomplete and partial will pass away“. God can still gift for special occasions, but in general it appears that Jesus imparted “complete and perfect” knowledge — which thus allowed those, charismatic gifts, to “cease”, “pass away” (verses 9-10 of 1 Corinthians 13).
I think that, from Jesus and Paul, is a better standard than what the NAR is practicing.
“These are the true and exact words of God.”
– Revelation 19:9
Is Jesus’ standard your standard, or has your church prophet lowered the standards like they have done at Bill Johnson’s apostate Bethel Church in Redding, CA? Does your church allow your prophets to lie, and then ask for forgiveness later (or not), and continue right on as if they had not caused God to lie?
“Apologies from the many “prophets” of the New Apostolic Reformation who falsely prophesied President Trump’s reelection are pouring in [cr Nov. 7, 2020], including apologies from Kris Vallotton, Shawn Bolz, and Jeremiah Johnson.
They say their failed prophecies don’t make them false prophets.They maintain that they’re still genuine prophets of God, and they stress that they have prophesied accurately in the past. Yet they admit that, this time, they missed it big time….” – Sorry, not sorry: Why the NAR prophets’ apologies for getting things wrong don’t cut it
– Written By Holly Pivec and Doug Geivett.
“Steve Schultz, founder of the prophetic website Elijah List, which has a YouTube broadcast called Elijah Streams, commented Nov. 10 that interest in the prophetic is so high right now, he’s getting 100,000 views for some of his broadcasts.
“The prophets aren’t backing off what they prophesied,” he said on the air. “They’ve known it, they’ve said it; they are not backing off.”
– Source: The Charismatic Christians prophesying Trump’s victory (and not backing down),
“…For the testimony of Jesus
is the spirit of prophecy
[His life and teaching
are the heart of prophecy]”
– (see this at the end of verse 10 of Revelation 19:9-10).
Totally Heretical
Are modern day (2022) “speakers for God” following the example set by Jesus and by this angel here in Revelation 19:9-10? Do they also say this?
“These are the true and exact words of God.”
-Said by the powerful angel (Revelation 18:21) in Revelation 19:9
No. I think NAR-type “speakers for God” are too busy formulating their lie. They need to study the Bible more (2 Timothy 2:15).
They’ve known it,
they’ve said it;
they are not backing off.”
– Prophet Steve Schultz
Caught in a lie
Modern NAR type prophets do not speak forth “true and exact words of God.” They are a different breed, trained by their NAR type church with (supposedly) newly revealed instructions from God. They feel they are special and get special secret knowledge that nobody else has. Amazing.
The modern charismatic NAR type churches have reportedly (as in “how can we believe these former “prophet liars” now?) …received a new revelation from God Himself about being a prophet for these days. They are taught:
“just say whatever comes to you…”
and
“it’s okay if you are wrong.”
The new revelation (which is not of God)
The new revelation allowing erroneous prophesying goes something like this (my recap; not quoting them):
I have no idea when, or who, but… it’s been said by some prophet: We have been told by God that prophets of today are under the “new covenant” and thus no longer are subject to the Old Testament instructions by God, no longer under God’s wrath for false prophets. You can get it wrong a time or two. It’s okay. He’s got you covered.
“it’s okay if you are wrong”
NAR type Prophet Guidelines
Summarizing the new NAR type Prophet Guidelines (recap of the NAR type prophet’s rules for himself):
1. I (a prophet blessed by my NAR type church) received a direct message from God Almighty saying to all prophets: It is okay to be wrong with your prophetic message. (Note: Only he has heard this from God.)
2. The Old Testament warnings about falsely prophesying (Ezekiel 13:8) — have been made obsolete by the New Covenant (Hebrews 8).
3. Prophets are no longer subject to God’s wrath for falsely prophesying. (This is according to their “new” revelation, since if they are “false”, that would make them “false prophets” per the OT, and God’s wrath falls on false prophets.)
The Vision by John on Patmos
9 I, John, your brother and companion in the [a]tribulation and kingdom and patient endurance which are in Jesus, was on the island called Patmos, [exiled there] because of [my preaching of] the word of God [regarding eternal salvation] and the testimony of Jesus Christ.
10 I was in the [b]Spirit [in special communication with the Holy Spirit and empowered to receive and record the revelation from Jesus Christ] on the [c]Lord’s Day, and I heard behind me a loud voice like the sound of a trumpet,
11 saying, “Write on a scroll what you see [in this revelation], and send it to the [d]seven churches—to Ephesus and to Smyrna and to Pergamum and to Thyatira and to Sardis and to Philadelphia and to Laodicea.” – Revelation 1:9-11
Truly biblical prophets speak forth “true and exact words of God” Himself. They don’t just “make it up as they go along”.
They went out from us
Jesus was fully aware that one of His disciples, one of HIS, was not for Him (John 13:18). And the same is true in churches today. He knows those in churches who are not really of Him.
18 I am not speaking of all of you. I know whom I have chosen; but [this has happened] in order that the Scripture may be fulfilled: ‘He who eats My bread has raised up his heel against Me [as My enemy].’
– John 13:18
I am very, very concerned that “God is against” many so-called believers in Jesus. If so, many will be turned away by Jesus soon. 1
Resisting and rebelling and complaining
The definition of “raised up his heel against Me” is basically “resisting, rebelling and complaining”. When you resist and rebel and complain against God’s standards… you are in danger of being “My enemy” AMP version, as Jesus said about Judas.
And John similarly said this also (and it is mentioned in Acts 15:24): 2
19 They went out from us
[seeming at first to be Christians],
but they were not really of us
[because they were
not truly born again
and spiritually transformed];
for if they had been of us,
they would have remained with us;
but they went out
[teaching false doctrine],
so that it would be clearly shown
that none of them are of us.
– 1 John 2:19 Amplified Bible
Those in churches that bicker, moan and groan, and cause conflict, most likely are the tares — those that are not “of us”.
“they were not really of us”
Jesus is the New Covenant
We cannot say the Old Testament (OT) is obsolete (as NAR-type theology claims) merely because “salvation in Christ” has now been revealed in a New Covenant. The Judaic system of sacrifice of animals for forgiveness of sins – was symbolic of the future sacrifice Jesus was to make.
Jesus’ sacrifice as the perfect Lamb of God is the New Covenant that changed everything about forgiveness of sin. It did not change the Old Testament nor make it obsolete. Jesus fulfilled the Judaic system — “once for all”.
See: The Mystery of the Gospel has been revealed | The Mystery of the Gospel
The Old Testament is still truth for today
The Old Testament is still true today. It is an integral part of our Christian faith. It still teaches us (2 Timothy 3:16; Titus 3:8). For example:
Why would it be okay to lie now
Why would it be okay to lie now, just because we finally have the New Covenant of salvation in Christ?
Just because the mystery of salvation was finally revealed – we are now allowed to “lie forth” God’s not-real-words? It is absolutely stupididiotic NAR reasoning. And it is false. We must reject such philosophies of mere men, and their churches. We must reject modern-day prophets.
Deuteronomy 4:24
For the Lord your God
is a consuming fire;
He is a jealous (impassioned)
[a intolerant of unfaithfulness] God
[demanding what is rightfully and uniquely His].
BibleGateway Footnotes:
Deuteronomy 4:24 I.e.
[a] intolerant of unfaithfulness.
FOR MORE:
The Mystery of the Gospel has been revealed
Is Jesus’ worldview – your worldview?
Are you “contrary” – not conforming to the Gospel?
Living the good life – with courage and confident hope
Will you be turned away by Jesus?
Words of Mere Men Are Not God’s Words
Be careful that no one misleads you
Why listen to a false teacher?
About Being Apostate… following “another gospel”
About False Teachings of today
The Bethel Johnson’s Unbiblical Teachings
Do not attend apostate churches
The NAR – “A New ‘Reformation’ That Many Don’t Realize They’ve Joined
Sorry, not sorry: Why the NAR prophets’ apologies for getting things wrong don’t cut it – Written By Holly Pivec and Doug Geivett Jan 10, 2021 Exerpt:
“Kris Vallotton—the chief “prophet” at Bethel Church in Redding, California—posted a video on Facebook, Nov. 7, 2020, apologizing for his prophecy that President Trump would be reelected to a second consecutive term in office. He removed it shortly after posting it, but reposted it on Jan. 8, 2021, after the U.S. Congress certified the Electoral College vote.
Apologies from the many “prophets” of the New Apostolic Reformation who falsely prophesied President Trump’s reelection are pouring in, including apologies from Kris Vallotton, Shawn Bolz, and Jeremiah Johnson.
They say their failed prophecies don’t make them false prophets.They maintain that they’re still genuine prophets of God, and they stress that they’ve prophesied accurately in the past. Yet they admit that, this time, they missed it big time.”
Footnotes
- Definition. In this verse the one who has “raised up his heel against” Christ,
‘He who eats My bread has raised up his heel against Me [as My enemy].’ – John 13:18
is similar to the term we use today, “kicked up one’s heels“, which means (per MerriamWebster):
to show opposition: resist, rebel
to protest strenuously or urgently; express grave discontent
broadly: complain. - Acts 15:24 “…certain which went out from us have troubled you with words, subverting your souls, saying, Ye must be circumcised, and keep the law: to whom we gave no such commandment”.
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